Curse

Adraeus · Jun 17, 2005, 07:52 PM // 19:52

See images for descriptions.

The cape physics needs work. When the character moves, the cape may swing and clip through the character.

Epinephrine · Jun 17, 2005, 07:54 PM // 19:54

Lol, you think that's bad, when a male monk flexes it cuts his head off.

Kuku Monk · Jun 17, 2005, 07:55 PM // 19:55

Some of the cut scenes will have characters clipping into each other

Adraeus · Jun 17, 2005, 07:56 PM // 19:56

These type of bugs affect gameplay and functionality, and they should have never made it into release.

phearless · Jun 17, 2005, 08:37 PM // 20:37

how does it effect gameplay, it only effects realism and your eye. It in no way changes the way you play. Also this happens to all proffesions. And on your first picture where you said that it is to straight or whatever, thats because your toon is standing at an angle. It is Parralel to his body, his legs and body are NOT aligned. His body is a little twisted so it looks like the cape is at an angle, but it really isnt.

Talesin Darkbriar · Jun 17, 2005, 08:41 PM // 20:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adraeus

These type of bugs affect gameplay and functionality, and they should have never made it into release.

ROFLMAO.

I'm sorry. You really haven't a clue do you? The minor, no wait, make that petty and otherwise unmentionable issue of cape edges clipping renders Guild Wars unplayable?

You need to go to a REAL game with REAL clipping issues!
May I propose EQ2?
I suggest an iksar or female elf character - so you can get the full effect.

When you are back in here in 10 minutes flat screaming GOOD GAWD! You'll realize - fully - how silly your comments truly are.

GW is a gift from heaven in comparison to the clipping hell of EQ2.

Talesin

Rhunex · Jun 17, 2005, 08:55 PM // 20:55

I have to agree with talesin on this one, it's not a major issue. Try the clipping errors in games like Tribes: Vengeance with force fields, where you can launch mortars and grenades through enemy forcefields(illegal on ladder sites of course).

Those are the kinds of clipping errors that HAVE to be fixed...sadly for T:V they will never be fixed due to VUG's lack of interest in their own games :*(

Navaros · Jun 17, 2005, 08:57 PM // 20:57

not sure if it's a graphics card problem of mine, or a clipping bug. but i have a Warrior, and his butt always clips thru the back of his cape every time i run

it's very annoying. if it is a clipping bug, it should definitely be fixed

Slade xTekno · Jun 17, 2005, 08:59 PM // 20:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Talesin Darkbriar

ROFLMAO.

I'm sorry. You really haven't a clue do you? The minor, no wait, make that petty and otherwise unmentionable issue of cape edges clipping renders Guild Wars unplayable?

You need to go to a REAL game with REAL clipping issues!
May I propose EQ2?
I suggest an iksar or female elf character - so you can get the full effect.

When you are back in here in 10 minutes flat screaming GOOD GAWD! You'll realize - fully - how silly your comments truly are.

GW is a gift from heaven in comparison to the clipping hell of EQ2.

Talesin

Um, he was being sarcastic. Lighten up please.

To be honest, there isn't much that can be done about clipping with flowing objects like that. The only game that comes close on this is DOA, but that's a totally different issue.

Talesin Darkbriar · Jun 17, 2005, 09:07 PM // 21:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slade xTekno

Um, he was being sarcastic. Lighten up please.

To be honest, there isn't much that can be done about clipping with flowing objects like that. The only game that comes close on this is DOA, but that's a totally different issue.

I WISH he was being sarcastic. Because this is otherwise quite funny.
Does a sarcastic person link 3 screens of the clipping conundrum? Inconceivable!

Oh..you are Slade...uh, don't review my response to your dual -wielding post...

Tal

RTSFirebat · Jun 17, 2005, 10:26 PM // 22:26

Well the way I see it... since the capes look like complete crap on the small built females avatars in the game, I refuse to join any guide till a smaller version of the capes or the capes are made toggleable.

PLEASE A.NET... DO SOMETHING ABOUT THEM!

Adraeus · Jun 17, 2005, 10:34 PM // 22:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Talesin Darkbriar

I'm sorry. You really haven't a clue do you?

We'll see. Your apology is accepted in advance.

Quote:

The minor, no wait, make that petty and otherwise unmentionable issue of cape edges clipping renders Guild Wars unplayable?

No, I recommend you read carefully and not re-interpret what is written. I never claimed these clipping issues render Guild Wars unplayable.

In Massively Multiplayer Online Role-Playing Games, character customization is a major component. When a component does not function correctly (i.e., when the result of a function deviates from the expected and/or intended result), then the component is considered flawed. In a well-organized defect resolution system, bugs which directly affect a major component are inherently major defects and are not acceptable for release.

While Guild Wars does not provide a persistent world, Guild Wars is technologically defined as a Massively Multiplayer Online Role-Playing Game (regardless of how NCsoft "prefers" to describe the product they developed.) Considering this attribute, character customization is an inherently major component of Guild Wars along with the creation of guilds and the additional character customizations that follow guild membership (i.e., guild capes). While incorrect display of and clipping issues with guild capes are minor graphics bugs, these bugs also affect gameplay (e.g., the major character customization component) and thus become major gameplay bugs.

dansamy · Jun 17, 2005, 10:52 PM // 22:52

A major gameplay bug would be running through mountains on the way back to where you died. (*cough cough* Alesia) Or being stuck on the side of a cliff unable to move. My monk managed that. My party had to quit the mission because I was stuck and they were dead.

Adraeus · Jun 17, 2005, 11:10 PM // 23:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by dansamy

A major gameplay bug would be running through mountains on the way back to where you died. (*cough cough* Alesia) Or being stuck on the side of a cliff unable to move. My monk managed that. My party had to quit the mission because I was stuck and they were dead.

I'm using the term "major" and "minor" differently than bug classes. The gameplay bug to which you refer should have been attributed the highest class and should have been addressed before production. In an online role-playing game, character customization bugs are high priority mid-class major defects because character customization is a major component.

RTSFirebat · Jun 17, 2005, 11:45 PM // 23:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by dansamy

A major gameplay bug would be running through mountains on the way back to where you died. (*cough cough* Alesia) Or being stuck on the side of a cliff unable to move. My monk managed that. My party had to quit the mission because I was stuck and they were dead.

That bug has been fixed now as far as I can see.. there was a AI update a week ago.

Slade xTekno · Jun 17, 2005, 11:50 PM // 23:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Talesin Darkbriar

I WISH he was being sarcastic. Because this is otherwise quite funny.
Does a sarcastic person link 3 screens of the clipping conundrum? Inconceivable!

Oh..you are Slade...uh, don't review my response to your dual -wielding post...

Tal

Lol. I found it entertaining [well, the fact that you didn't read the whole thread].

The response will be up sometime later tonight.

theclam · Jun 18, 2005, 12:04 AM // 00:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adraeus

I'm using the term "major" and "minor" differently than bug classes. The gameplay bug to which you refer should have been attributed the highest class and should have been addressed before production. In an online role-playing game, character customization bugs are high priority mid-class major defects because character customization is a major component.

Character customization defects are a major problem, but this isn't one of those. This is an aesthetic issue that doesn't affect gameplay. For an aesthetic issue, it's a very minor one, as well. Therefore, it's a very minor bug.

Plus, it would take a LOT of processing power to get the cape to stop clipping into things, although it might take a bit less to make it not clip into your own character model.

Adraeus · Jun 18, 2005, 12:54 AM // 00:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by theclam

Character customization defects are a major problem, but this isn't one of those. This is an aesthetic issue that doesn't affect gameplay. For an aesthetic issue, it's a very minor one, as well. Therefore, it's a very minor bug.

From the player's perspective, capes are an aesthetic bonus. From the designer's perspective, capes are a necessary component of the guild-character customization system; thus, bugs which affect the the primary function of a component are major bugs. (By the way, "major/minor" categorization is a black-and-white way of looking at bugs, which is why I'm using those terms differently. Effective defect tracking and resolution uses various levels of priority and severity.)

This is a major bug that affects a major component of Guild Wars' gameplay.

A major bug affects a major component whereas a minor bug affects a minor component; however, majority and minority do not carry priority or severity ratings.

Let's use an example bug report to demonstrate bug class and priority:

Quote:

BUG REPORT #1
Summary
Player accepts invitation from guild with cape and cape is not displayed.

Steps to reproduce
1. Guild leader sends player invitation
2. Player accepts invitation

Result
The guild cape neither displays nor is attached to the player's character.

Expected result
The guild cape displays and is attached to the player's character model.

Quote:

BUG REPORT #2
Summary
Player accepts invitation from guild with cape and cape is improperly displayed.

Steps to reproduce
1. Guild leader sends player invitation
2. Player accepts invitation

Result
The guild cape displays and is attached to the player's character; however, the guild cape is displayed on the front of the character's model.

Expected result
The guild cape displays and is attached to the back of the player's character model.

Since Bug #1 directly affects the primary function of the component, Bug Report #1 is issued a higher priority and severity than Bug Report #2. Bug Report #2 demonstrates that Bug #1 is fixed, but the cape is displaying on the wrong side of the player's character. Bug Report #2 directly affects the primary function of the component and is, therefore, issued a lower priority than Bug Report #1 but a high severity. Since the primary function of character customization (again, a major component) is to provide players an avenue of individuality, defects which affect that function are high priority major bugs. The issue I reported is a high-priority high-severity major mid-class character customization bug. When a bug is "mid-class", that means the bug is a general issue, does not prevent progression, and negatively affects the player's experience. Bugs which affect a major component that affect the player's experience are "major" bugs. Major bugs are not necessarily high-priority high-severity upper-class issues.

Consider this: how bugs are rated differ according to technology and genre. In a single-player RPG, this collision issue would be downgraded to a low-priority high-severity minor graphics bug. Why is this issue then a major gameplay bug in Guild Wars? Character customization is extremely important to the success of Massively Multiplayer Online Role-Playing Games; in addition, character customization is a gameplay component. Since this bug affects a major component, it is major itself. Likewise, in a single-player RPG, this bug would affect a minor component and therefore be a minor issue.

Quote:

Plus, it would take a LOT of processing power to get the cape to stop clipping into things, although it might take a bit less to make it not clip into your own character model.

Whether preventing the cape from violating collision boxes would increase CPU usage is highly dependent on the efficiency of the solution and the related algorithms. The cape, for instance, could wrap around the Elementalist character's bottom when in the sitting position. The cape's physics could be improved so that collision (or lack thereof) into the character is not an option.